[Glass] Questions about Rowan 3

[James Foster]

Hello Marten,

Given that you are a Jade user, I’d like to hear a bit more about your environment, application, and process. What is your development environment? Presumably you are using Windows for Jade. Is that your primary environment? Do you have macOS? If you create an Ubuntu headless VM will it be in Windows or elsewhere?

Given that you are having trouble with GsDevkit_home, may I ask why you initially selected it? Are there features in it that you need? 

What is your application environment? Are you using Seaside? What sort of source code management are you using for your application?

Perhaps with this information we can help find a path that works.

James

> On Nov 23, 2024, at 1:24 AM, Marten Feldtmann via Glass <glass at lists.gemtalksystems.com> wrote:
> 
> Hello Lisa,
> 
> the whole situation - and considering the timeframes we are used within the Gemstone/S development - gives me a VERY uncertain feeling about the situation, considering the fact, that I am a Jade user.
> 
> I stopped working with 3.7.x, because the whole 3.7.x (x >= 1) is on stop for development on GsDevkit_home. My projects and products are based on 3.6.5 (and one is based on 3.5.8) and I stopped all plans to update them to 3.7.
> 
> My current plan is to build an Ubuntu 22.04 headless vm for the only purpose to be able to build initial stones with GsDevkit_home as long as it is possible and to look how far I come with the 3.6.x branch. Perhaps even try to support GsDevKit_home for my own platform only (but I fear the complexity of that approach)
> 
> "and the migration pathway from Metacello to Rowan has not been developed"
> 
> Honestly, I am - as a customer - actually in the mood to say: do not jump on Gemstone/S at this moment: GsDevkit_home is fading, Monticello is not the future but is working today, Rowan is a moving target but is the future but we do not know, how to go from Monticello to Rowan (as of today).
> 
> Sleepless ....
> 
> Marten
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> Lisa Almarode via Glass <glass at lists.gemtalksystems.com> hat am 21.11.2024 01:52 CET geschrieben:
>> 
>> 
>> Hi Patrik!  Nice to hear from you.
>> 
>> Rowan is a source code management system, that can be used with Git for
>> managing GemStone Smalltalk source code. Rowan 3 means version 3.x of
>> Rowan, Rowan 2 and Rowan 1 are also in use; and Rowan is a successor to
>> Metacello. Dale can describe the differences between all these in detail.
>> 
>> Rowan is designed to be used with Jadeite, to provide an integrated
>> GemStone code development environment. Historically GemStone has not had
>> its own GUI, and customers have had to use GBS in a third-party client
>> Smalltalk, or Jade, if they did not want to work in topaz.  Rowan itself
>> provides much better code management than class-based text files, and we
>> have been using Rowan internally for source code management for several
>> years. While there have been versions of Jadeite supporting Rowan 1 and
>> 2, these only run on Windows. A Pharo version of Jadeite for Rowan 3 is
>> under development, currently at an early alpha stage.
>> 
>> Unfortunately, Rowan 3 is not currently compatible with seaside, since
>> it does not support session methods; and the migration pathway from
>> Metacello to Rowan has not been developed. Rowan 3 also needs the latest
>> versions of GemStone, since it relies on features added in 3.7 and bugs
>> fixed in 3.7.x.
>> 
>> What we are working on that might be helpful for you, is a version of
>> Jadeite for Pharo that is usable against extent0.dbf, without needing to
>> load all of Rowan into the extent; it uses a Rowan stub to forward
>> messages appropriately. This environment would be compatible with a
>> seaside or seaside+tODE environment, and existing package management tools.
>> 
>> Let us know if you would like to discuss this in more detail.
>> 
>> Lisa Almarode
>> 
>> 
>> On 11/20/2024 3:45 AM, Patrik Svestka via Glass wrote:
>>> Hi everyone,
>>> 
>>> I do have some questions concerning Rowan 3. I have searched for them
>>> myself, but I'm probably missing some pieces to the puzzle.
>>> 
>>> This is summary of what I have found out:
>>>  - Rowan 3 is an OSS code package manager using git as backend
>>>  - Supports both FileTree (repo info: Monticello repository for
>>> directory-based Monticello packages enabling the use of different kinds
>>> of CVS (e.g. git). for managing Smalltalk source code) and Tonel (repo
>>> info: a file-per-class format for monticello repositories) repositories
>>>  - Jadeite needs Rowan (3)
>>> 
>>> My questions:
>>>  - What problem are you solving with Rowan 3?
>>>  - What are the key differences between Rowan 3 and its predecessor(s)?
>>>  - How to load Rowan 3 to other extent like a seaside one (e.g. for GS
>>> 3.7.1)?
>>>  - Is there a possibility to add Rowan 3 to an older GS (extent)?
>>>  - What are its limitations?
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